The Downbeat - 26 October 2009 - #109 - The T Day Edition

by Basketball John on Nov 26, 2009 8:23 AM MST in The Downbeat Comment 29 comments

Just a quickie DB this morning. The biggest Jazz turkeys of all time in no particular order. Click on their name for the turkey incident

1_medium Officer Olden Polynice

via hoopedia.nba.com

2_medium DeShawn Stevenson, this and most recently this,

via i36.tinypic.com

8_medium Jason Hart

4_medium Carlos Boozer, regardless.

5_medium Who else? Let us know.

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Ostertag?

Should we make a list, or is it enough to just mention him? I was new to the Jazz in 97-98 (had just come out here for college), so I wasn’t really a die-hard. But doesn’t it seem like if he had played consistently at about 65% of his potential that they would have won both times against the Bulls? What was his plus/minus?

I'll make it coach.

by MTN on Nov 26, 2009 9:09 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

i'd leave him off

hate him if you will, but in his prime he was one of the best offensive rebounders and shotblockers in the league

by bigdog'sshades on Nov 26, 2009 9:24 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

Which ten minutes were his prime?

I'll make it coach.

by MTN on Nov 26, 2009 10:08 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd take Ostertag over fess/koof any day

Sorry BBJ.. :)

by chamont on Nov 26, 2009 10:37 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

i have a reliable source that said ostertag went on a hunt in utah and had his wife carry his backpack and supplies while ostertag carried only his gun. the guide was quite surprised that ostertag would make his wife do that. i can understand why malone was frustrated with ostertag’s work ethic.

by P_Dizzle on Nov 26, 2009 1:43 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

Gordan Giracek

I wonder if any of the several coaches ever explained to him what “traveling” is and why he was called for it nearly every time he touched the ball.

I'll make it coach.

by MTN on Nov 26, 2009 9:13 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

i would nominate mark jackson for trying to turn the locker room against stockton, luther wright for the drugs/alcohol/other shenanigans (although it appears he has turned his life around http://nba.fanhouse.com/2009/11/24/to-hell-and-back-with-luther-wright/), and john amaechi for his general FAIL

by bigdog'sshades on Nov 26, 2009 9:23 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

I've never heard about the Mark Jackson thing... anyone have a link or a quick retell?

I'll make it coach.

by MTN on Nov 26, 2009 10:09 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

This is what I've heard...

Someone within the organization told me this, so I think it’s pretty legit. Mark Jackson didn’t like playing behind Stockton. Apparently he always felt that he was better than him. So he spent that season moping around and trying to turn the younger guys against Stockton. I’m not sure how successful he was. I gotta think he wasn’t that successful because there was also a guy in the locker room named Karl Malone. And as I recall, Malone and Stockton were pretty close.

Jackson, on the other hand, is a turkey.

Whitewater In The Morning

by neff on Nov 26, 2009 10:22 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

hmmm....15000+ assists to 10000+

Was Jackson delusional? on Crack? Didn’t the league have to make a rule to outlaw guards backing down smaller guards from half-court to the block over 22 seconds of each possession…. did he think he was better looking? what?

I'll make it coach.

by MTN on Nov 26, 2009 12:08 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

agreed

can’t stand mark jackson.

by P_Dizzle on Nov 26, 2009 1:38 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

agreed

i’ve been unable to stand the sight of mark jackson ever since i heard about this—especially because this was during stock’s final season, and some have hinted that all of this drama was one of the reasons why stock decided to call it quits that year.

by moni on Nov 26, 2009 5:03 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

i couldn't find a published article

with a quick internet search. but basically what neff said. it was a well-known incident and probably the main reason jackson can’t get a coaching job even though he would otherwise have solid credentials as an ex-PG.

by bigdog'sshades on Nov 26, 2009 10:31 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

i heard the same thing. i would agree

i know someone that went on a hunt with jerry sloan and sloan’s boy. sloan mentioned to him that mark jackson was a cancer in the locker room and had the team split. he was telling people that stockton won’t pass you the ball, i will. i heard nothing but bad things about him.

by P_Dizzle on Nov 26, 2009 1:37 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

the story on luther wright is great reading

take a look at the photo gallery…the lavender knee brace is hilarious. also, fes is wearing wright’s number now….

by moni on Nov 26, 2009 5:15 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

over my morning coffee

i went back to where i remember first reading about this and found a jazzfans thread that referenced a random SI article…and then kept digging until i found the issue that was referenced and finally the title and the archived copy.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1028560/index.htm

The NBA’s alltime assist leader may be getting a push out the door by his new backup this season and the No. 2 man on the career assist list, 38-year-old Mark Jackson. Three members of the Jazz organization now understand why Jackson has been traded seven times in his 16-year career: They say that over a period of weeks, he succeeded in turning several teammates against Stockton by repeatedly remarking that those players would be better off if Jackson were the Jazz’s floor leader. Other players rallied around Stockton, who, because of his quiet nature, was vulnerable to the locker room politicking. The rift on the Jazz was mended, though not before Stockton’s pride had been wounded. “There was no question it hurt John, because you could see him withdraw,” says a high-ranking team official. “But he’ll never talk about it, just as he won’t talk about injuries, because then he feels like he’s making excuses for himself.”

Jackson says his actions were in no way aimed at Stockton. “I’m a born leader, and if people take that as manipulation, then maybe they haven’t been around leaders,” he says. “I make no apologies for embracing people and talking to people and making them feel like they’re important. Maybe in the past those stray dogs have been left on the side, but that’s not the way I treat people.”

Sloan reached a breaking point in mid-January, when he lost his temper over the divisiveness on his team and stormed out of the gym during practice. He was threatening to retire then and there, only to be dissuaded at an emergency meeting called by team owner Larry Miller, president Dennis Haslam, general manager Kevin O’Connor and Sloan’s wife, Bobbye. “That had the real potential of Jerry saying, ‘To heck with it,’ and walking away,” says Miller, who believes that Sloan’s seven-game suspension for shoving referee Courtney Kirkland on Jan. 28 was the result of his built-up frustrations. Sloan’s 15 seasons with the Jazz are the longest stretch with the same team by any coach currently in pro sports, and he maintains that he isn’t thinking ahead to next year. “I talk in terms of days,” he says half-jokingly, “because any day in this business they can fire you.”

i hate mark jackson forever.

by moni on Nov 26, 2009 5:42 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs