Kevin O'Connor and Jerry Sloan talk about Eric Maynor
by Basketball John on Jun 25, 2009 9:14 PM MDT
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thanks for the sound, BBJ
Greatly appreciated as I was out all night and missed the draft and the reactions to the pick.
FWIW, Chad Ford loves the pick. Said Maynor is NBA-ready and also called him [and I quote] “the most underrated player in the draft.”
by Brigadier Pudding on Jun 26, 2009 12:29 AM MDT reply actions
I know that Jazz fans weren't pleased by the pick, because we didn't get Hansbrough or whatever.
But this is a very good pick and I believe it was the best move for the Jazz to make given the situation. Maynor should be able to be a primary backup.
A couple other guys behind him may turn out to be better, but they were also riskier. Guys like Blair and such.
I am not doing cartwheels over the Suton pick. But it wasn’t a bad pick. He just won’t play more than 10 minutes in the league this year, if he even plays one.
The more you try to erase me, the more that I appear.
Draft grade F
The Jazz draft the one position where there the player won’t play and the team can’t get any better.
In the process, since some teams were reportedly willing to pay cash to get into the first round, the Jazz lost a chance to perpetuate their bluff of being willing to go into the luxury tax to keep Millsap.
With respect, I totally disagree
The middle and the wings are where we struggle for the most part. So to get better at those positions, we would have to draft somebody better than (or with more potential than) our wings and middle BACKUPS. Was there anybody left better than Koof, Fesenko, Korver, Miles, or (let’s add him here) Brewer? Somebody to supplant them in the depth chart? I don’t think so. In fact, I’d take Fesenko over Thabeet. (I can’t believe those idiots took Thabeet and company over Rubio.)
On the other hand, I think Ronnie Price should be sweating right now. He’s absolutely in danger of losing the back-up spot to Eric “the Mayor” Maynor (let’s open up the nickname sweepstakes right now). So I think Maynor represents the best possibility at upgrading a position – and arguably the most important need for the jazz. For all our talk of needing perimeter D and paint D, it’s the five minutes of Brevin Knight that killed us in the last month of the season to get us our playoff seeding.
Given healthy doses of PT, I think we’ll all come to like the Mayor. It will be sad to see him traded to a team that needs a starting PG in three years.
I'll make it coach.
Nothing against Maynor
He might be a great player someday. But it won’t be with the Jazz. Mark my words here, he will end his stay with the Jazz, be it one or ten years, averaging less then 10 minutes a game. That is my problem with the pick… there is no potential with it. Even if he turns out to be a stud, we would lose him in four years to free agency. Compare that to any other position where a player who turn out great would start. For instance, if Koof turns out to be great, even if we didn’t loose anyone this year, we would trade one of the big men and start Koof. Even if we drafted a combo guard, we could get him 30 min a game if need be. But a pure point, sorry, no burn possible.
So knowing that, nothing wrong with drafting a backup… normally. But right now, that is money (assuming we could have sold the pick) that could be going towards keeping Millsap. There are alot of D-league points that could hold down the fort for the practice team for league minimum, allowing us more cap room. And that is what I am saying about this blowing Millers bluff about going over the cap to sign Millsap. If that were the case, we would be penny pinching right now to be able to afford it.
With all due respect… (and your arguments are well put) my grade stays an F!
you might not be wrong
about Maynor not being a great player until he leaves the Jazz. Here’s what I would like from him. I would like for him to own the backup point guard spot. I would like for him to be able to hold, and dare I say, increase, leads while Deron is resting. I would like for him to be able to work the backcourt with Deron at times if need be against small-ball teams. And I would like for him to develop himself in his time with the Jazz so that, if and when he leaves to become the player he really can be, he will be a valuable trade asset.
I see your points about selling the pick to save money, and maybe KOC attempted to do just that but there were no takers. Maybe. But I believe we took the best player available for our team, and if he contributes and makes himself valuable, I’ll be more than happy.
Uh, do you think you could draw me like a ninja?
That may very well happen
And if so, then excellent. Here’s why:
First, he will be a cheap backup. If he turns into even a good player, he will be cheap for the Jazz for the next 3-4 years just like Paul Millsap has been.
Second, if he turns into a Mo Williams-type player and needs to go somewhere where he can start, he becomes a valuable trade piece.
Finally, if the worst should happen in three years and Deron opts out, we have a potential plan B that’s been in the system for three years. He’s not going to be able to pick up where Deron is at, but it could be good insurance.
The only other two players that the Jazz would have taken, Blair and Young, fell 16 and 17 picks behind the Jazz. So more than half of the rest of the league passed on them.
As far as selling the pick for cash, that could have helped. But we did have a need for a backup PG and the FO apparently thought that was worth more than what they would have gotten to sell the pick.
I wouldn’t worry about this draft. In a few years I don’t think it will have been of any consequence for 90% of the teams in the league.
by Basketball John on Jun 27, 2009 9:36 AM MDT up reply actions
Re: Selling the pick
All that said, if you assume everyone opts out, you have a line-up right now of
PG- Deron
SG- Brewer
SF- CJ, Harpring (who’s done)
PF- AK
C- The Koof, Fesenko
That puts your team needs at… well, everywhere.
And there was no obvious consensus on BPA at #20… no team ahead of the Jazz pulled a surprise and reached for anyone (well, at least not compared to what everyone had been hearing). Which meant that at #20, they Jazz were stuck looking for BPA in a pool of players where everyone disagreed on the best player left. The Jazz thought the best player left was Maynor, and took him. Can’t really complain.
Selling the pick doesn’t work, because you’re still way short on cash to fill all the other needs. Getting a relatively cheap, yet still experienced (4 years of college) back-up is always a plus. Sure, he might not have the ‘upside’ that some of the other picks have… but the Jazz don’t need upside in a back-up PG. They need someone that can come in and not suck. And the chances of finding a starter at #20, no matter the position, is fairly slim.
The best 2-guards to go after #20 were Wayne Ellington (#28) and Toney Douglas (#29). The Jazz worked out Douglas, and if they had really liked him, they would’ve taken him at #20.
Oh, and about Blair. He’s got no knees, and he’s 6’7. Which is way too small for a PF in the league. The first PF to go after Maynor, was Taj Gibson… another guy the Jazz worked out. The Jazz, if they go draft PFs, need another “big” one… guys in the mold of ’Sap & Booze are nice, but totally irrelevant when 7-footers like Gasol & Bynum are destroying you inside. And there were none of those guys available in the draft after Thabeet. None.
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Whose to say his upside doesn't approach D-Will
He’s 6’3" (with shoes, they say), young enough to put more weight on, and the most important thing – probably the reason Sloan liked the pick – he improved statistically EVERY YEAR he was in college. Assuming that trend continues, who’s to say he won’t be a Deron-like guard in three years. Deron’s not a fast-as-flash score-first AI-prototype either, so it seems to me Eric Maynor may be the guard in the league who is MOST LIKE D-will, at least potentially. They say his long-range shooting needs work, so he’ll work on it. Aside from that and the weight, what’s Deron got on him more than a few years of experience (granted, a lot has been packed in those few years, including Olympics and WCF)? I don’t mean to overstate the comparison, I’m just saying they are similar – I imagine that’s what the front office sees anyway – there’s a very specific type of PG for Sloan’s team, and Maynor fits the type.
So, sure, I can see him as a valued plan B in a worst case scenario. More importantly, I hope he becomes a solid backup who can keep Deron’s momentum game in and game out, give Deron longer rests on road trips and back-to-backs, etc. And if that only happens for 3 years, let’s take it. As BBJ said, he’s cheap for now. I like the trade asset argument too.
I’m pleased.
I'll make it coach.
It is possible there wasn't really buyers for the draft pick
That’s just what was being reported leading into the draft. I’m just saying, if that rookie salary is what makes or breaks signing Millsap…. then its a bad move to draft someone who (on the Jazz) will never really get any playing time. And the money might be close. Lets say Boozer opts out, and Okur and Korver don’t. With this pick, (the cap isn’t set yet) but the would have about 7 million to sign Millsap. His ope market price is probably about 8. Saving that million and gaining a little cash might have sent a message and deterred teams from going after Millsap, helping us to sign him.
Someone is going to sign 'Sap
and we’re going to have to match to keep him. Doesn’t really matter how much money we had, teams are going to bite on his youth/potential & his solid play so far. The Pistons, the Nets, the Suns, the Grizzlies, the Thuner… who knows. There are teams that need PFs. There are teams that need PFs and have money. He just needs to find one team that wants to give him some dough, and we’re in trouble. An extra couple million might’ve been nice. But then that goes into ‘Sap (along with the rest of our cap space) and we’re stuck without a back-up PG.
As for not getting big playing time… we thought that about Brevin/Price too… and then Deron went down to start the season. Sure, it was a freak accident, but still. Things happen. You need a solid back-up. Maynor is a solid back-up PG (or will be when he learns the system)… Price is a fine back-up combo guard, but not the PG j-slow wants. And Maynor will come cheaper than Price will/would.
True Blue Jazz
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RIP Nick Adenhart. 4/9/09
correct me if i'm wrong
but teams don’t get penalized for going over the cap to sign players they drafted.
They don't (I don't think)
but if they go and sign Booze or Okur and go over the cap, they’re out of luck.
True Blue Jazz
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I'm not certain
and I’m definitely not a salary-cap-ologist.
True Blue Jazz
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I wonder who we can find out from...
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Luxury tax
I don’t see how we can possibly keep Sap, Kover and Memo without paying the luxury tax. Especially if Memo’s starting to talk about “getting paid.” If I were the boss, I’d say, “If we can sign last year’s players minus booze or sign-n-trade booze, AND STILL GET another 35-minutes-per-game free agent, then I’ll pay the tax. If all we can do is maintain last year’s status quo and still lose Booze, that’s not going to push us into the top two of the WC. So might as well ditch all the money guys and start saving for next year’s free agent market.” In other words, I think this signing season is sink (let them run to the money) or swim (pay the tax and buy our way back into the WCF).
That said, I’m fairly certain we’ll keep Memo. The question is if that decision will cost us Millsap. Kover, as far as I’m concerned, is expendable.
I'll make it coach.
So, the question...
if you can only keep 1 of the 3 (’Sap, Booze, Okur)… who do you keep?
True Blue Jazz
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Actually
ignore this question. I’m gonna post a fanshot or fanpost or something.
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RIP Nick Adenhart. 4/9/09
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