Who Gets Cut? 2011 - Round 8

by Basketball John on Oct 24, 2011 12:41 PM MDT in SLC Dunk - Reader Polls

In our closest vote in Who Gets Cut, Devin Harris is let go after receiving just two more votes than Al Jefferson. It was tight all weekend but Harris ultimately gets the boot with 119 votes to Jefferson's 117.

This vote shouldn't be construed as meaning that we don't need a PG. It just so happens that with the past two seasons of Who Gets Cut, our best player has been our PG.

With Harris, I feel detached as a fan. He's a Jazz man so I'll always root for him. He's played decent for the Jazz when he's been healthy and could be our PG for the future. I think there's just been some disconnect because I'm not sure if he's going to be here after next season. With the team firmly committed to rebuilding, his role in that is unknown though Kevin O'Connor has stated that he was a target as well and not just filler.

Statistically speaking, Harris was right at his career averages last season in almost all of his numbers. His best season was in 2008-09 when he put up 21 & 7 with the Nets in his first year in New Jersey. That was a team that featured Vince Carter, Brook Lopez, and Keyon Dooling. The Nets were only the 16th-most efficient offense that season with a 24th-ranked defense. Looking at his career numbers though, Harris is pretty consistent which make you wonder if that's good enough? Is he going to have a breakout year? Or do we know everything we need to know about Harris at this point. If so, that's fine. Is that what the team needs going forward? I wish we had a season to find out.

So then there were four. Who gets the votes cast for Harris?

Previously on Who Gets Cut?

05. Devin Harris
06. Enes Kanter
07. Alec Burks
08. Jeremy Evans
09. C.J. Miles
10. Mehmet Okur
11. Raja Bell

Poll

Who Gets Cut? Round 8

Derrick Favors

4 votes

Gordon Hayward

13 votes

Al Jefferson

147 votes

Paul Millsap

83 votes

247 votes | Poll has closed

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Comments

As much as I love Millsap....

he should be the next one to get cut. Jefferson > Millsap. I know everyone loves him to death but if you think logically rather than emotionally than Millsaps’ # is up. Not that it really matters though…

by Mark Jay Wahlen on Oct 24, 2011 1:45 PM MDT reply actions

I agree. Even though Millsap has all of the right intangibles, he is an undersized PF at the end of the day.

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 2:21 PM MDT up reply actions

In addition, all indications are that Jefferson has spent the off-season getting in the best shape of his career.

Despite all of the potential of Favors, Hayward, Kanter and Burks, if Jefferson can get into the best shape of his career and be in a better system with better talent around him than ever before, he could easily be the best player on the Jazz for the next 2-3 seasons by a wide margin. Just before he was injured 3 years ago, he was well on his way to being an all star, and that was in a bad system with a lot less talent around him. Optimistically, Jefferson could be a 25/12 guy this year, without being a ballhog, and while working within the system. He could also get close to a couple of blocks a game on defense, while being a much better defender, as well. Let’s not give up on Jefferson, just because we’re sour about everything else that happened last season.

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 3:40 PM MDT up reply actions

Sorry man

But if Al’s the best player on the team, then we’re cheering for a lousy team.

I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time

by Yucca Man on Oct 24, 2011 8:34 PM MDT up reply actions

Fill in the blank:

If ________________ is the best player on the team, then we’re cheering for a lousy team.

Won’t that be the result, despite which Jazz player you put in the blank, at least for this year, and maybe next year, as well?

Unless one or several of the best players on the Jazz this year improve by at least 20%, I think you’ve pretty much stated what we’ll be cheering for.

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 10:56 PM MDT up reply actions

Let me correct myself--unless all of the best five players on the Jazz improve by at least 20%, I think you've pretty much stated what we'll be cheering for.

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 11:01 PM MDT up reply actions

But here's hoping

At least one of Favors, Hayward, Kanter, and Co. become better.

If you look entire abilities, and not just scoring/rebounding numbers, Hayward and Favors could be better within a year or so.

I sure as hell hope so, or it the Jazz will be in for a long period of lousy teams.

I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time

by Yucca Man on Oct 24, 2011 11:37 PM MDT up reply actions

I think Jazz fans should embrace Harris, because he is a very good point guard, and the Jazz have no chance of getting anyone better in the near future.

There are clearly no point guards in the upcoming draft with the potential to be better than Harris. After this year’s draft, the Jazz probably will not be picking very high in the draft for a long time (unless some of the Jazz’s young players are traded for draft picks in the near future). Therefore, it is unlikely the Jazz will get a point guard better than Harris in the draft.

There are only 7 point guards currently in the NBA that I would want more than Harris: (1) Rose, (2) Westbrook, (3) Wall, (4) Williams, (5) Rondo, (6) Paul, (7) Tyreke Evans (in that order). I don’t see the Jazz getting any of those point guards, because they are all pretty much looked at as being franchise players for their respective teams. I actually think Harris is currently a significantly better point guard than Wall and Evans, but I like their potential, so I would take them over Harris (although it was a difficult choice whether I would want Evans over Harris). Steve Nash is currently a better point guard than Harris, but he is at the end of his career, so I prefer Harris. Tony Parker is on about the same level as Harris, but he is quite a bit older than Harris, so I prefer Harris. I’m not sure yet whether Kyle Lowry is a better point guard than Harris, even though he is a bit younger than Harris, but he is too much of an unknown, so I prefer Harris. I think with the other talent the Jazz will have, a top-10 level point guard like Harris will be plenty good enough to take the Jazz to a high level of play.

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 2:20 PM MDT reply actions

I think Myck Kabango and Kendall Marshall would be

better pg’s for the Jazz. Both are legitimate pass first guys, and considering how much offensive firepower we have, that’s what we need.

As far as Al vs Sap, I voted for Al. It comes down to loyalty. Millsap has been here his whole career, and has played so hard for this franchise and the fans, I can’t let him go before Al. Also, he’s a much more efficient scorer than Al, and was the only clutch player post trade.

Utah>*

by Bebop on Oct 24, 2011 2:36 PM MDT up reply actions

I think you may be over valuing the two future rookies. They would both be lucky to be as good as Harris.

Also I know Harris isn’t D-Will, but people keep talking about how we need a pass first point guard. Devin shoots the ball less than D-Will, so it isn’t like Harris is the Iverson of PGs.

As far as Al and Millsap. I love both of the guys. But Al had better numbers in the clutch last year than Millsap. He shot the ball 6% higher than Millsap in the clutch and scored more points in the clutch than Millsap last year. How quick we remember the miracle in Miami, but forget Al’s tip in against Toronto, when Al willed us to a win with 34 points. Plus Al was loyal to the Jazz in that he played all 82 games last year and worked his butt off and improved the entire season. I think people remember what they want to about Al last season.

by BobbyD31 on Oct 24, 2011 3:01 PM MDT up reply actions

I'm gonna share something from a poster over on PeachTree Hoops

Color Me Bad
Why would trade for a guy that makes you worse defensively. In all honesty, this guy is worse than Jamal Crawford on defense. He already would become a liability on defense in a defensive scheme that is all about accountability. It speaks volumes when Jerry Sloan cannot teach the guy, and to those of you who say he has not had a good supporting cast you can’t get better than Deron Williams, Paul Millsap, and Andrei Kirilenko.

He is atrocious, abysmal, horrifying on defense. Jefferson can block shots in one-on-one scenario and does it pretty well (153), but he’s extremely slow-moving on defense, and doesn’t expend much energy on that end. He’s horrible on rotations and defensive reaction. Lead-footed, doesn’t rotate correctly , looks only for the big shot block , doesn’t exactly sprint back on transition defense, and often gets walloped by anybody on the post with some quickness (yeah, you know, guys like Joakim Noah)

I cannot express how much this would make our defense worse. He made a team ranked in 11th in defensive efficiency the year before into a team ranked 24th the next. He had the worst defensive differential per 100 possessions than any player in the league. Utah gave up 6.8 more points per 100 possessions when Jefferson was on the court than when he was off. 113.3 when he was ON, 106.5 when he was off.

One Guy

(by JoshChildressAfroIsCure4Cancer)

Those are some pretty depressing stats. His defense is SO bad, it’s just a drag. I do remember Al becoming a late season beast…something like 25 and 11 at the end of the stretch, right? But that defense just hurts the team so bad.

by Jeffersap on Oct 24, 2011 9:07 PM MDT up reply actions

As Much as I want to believe someone who thinks Josh Childress' Afro can cure cancer,

I will quote someone with who might have a touch more perspcetive. Let’s also look at what Zach Lowe of Sports Illustrated wrote:

“So why is Jefferson here at all? In part because, for all his flaws, Jefferson’s weird quick-release post game demands the kind of attention from defenses that can create openings for teammates. Utah was much better offensively with Jefferson in the game, though that probably had as much to do with the Jazz’s punchless bench as Big Al’s scoring. But there is value in a 20-point post scorer who snags an offensive board or two every night and commands a double team — when he holds the ball long enough to draw one.

“Jefferson’s defensive issues are real and they were a big part of why Utah ranked 29th in points per possession allowed on pick-and-rolls in which ball-handlers finished the play, per Synergy. But if you hammer Jefferson for that, you must acknowledge his decent shot-blocking and the fact that opposing big men shot just 82-of-231 (35.5 percent) against him in the post — a stingy number that ranked among the league’s 50 best marks for defenders.

Also, rebounding is part of defense, and Jefferson is a good rebounder. He’s overrated and overpaid (he’s owed a combined $29 million over the next two years), but there is value here, and there’s at least a chance we’ll see that value rise now that Jefferson gets a second consecutive season on a functional NBA team."

So basically, Jefferson isn’t perfect and does really struggle in the Pick and Role when the ball handler finishes the play. But he is a good one on one post defender, our best rebounder, and our best shot blocker. I saw progess with his rotations as the year went on, and it will likely be better next year if we force baseline rather than middle, like Corbin has mentioned, and he is playing more with Favors.

On a side note Jefferson only matched up with Noah for a few minutes last year total, because guys “like Noah” struggle defending Jefferson also. The Bulls started Kurt Thomas at center in both of their meetings against the Jazz last year.

by BobbyD31 on Oct 25, 2011 10:17 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

Wow

This just got serious. Hard vote to make. Went with Sap. You can never have too much size in the NBA.

by tyrantking on Oct 24, 2011 2:58 PM MDT reply actions

Darko Milicic and Nikola Pekovic salute you.

The more you try to erase me, the more that I appear.

by clarkpojo on Oct 24, 2011 5:08 PM MDT up reply actions

And Greg Oden...........................................................................................

The Orioles Suck!
Play FESS More!!!
I love men!
HEH!

by bucimislover on Oct 24, 2011 9:20 PM MDT up reply actions

I might be kind of greedy, but I say let's keep all our guys, unless we can replace them with someone who is clearly better for the same or less money.

Everyone keeps talking about how the Jazz need to trade someone in the front court, because it is overcroweded. However, unless there is an amnesty clause and the Jazz want to use it on Memo to get way under the cap and be profitable, I don’t see why the Jazz shouldn’t keep everyone (as well as re-signing Kirilenko, Watson and Fesenko) and see how it plays out. The Jazz will have a nice mix of capable young veterans and rookies/2nd year players with good potential, with a few serviceable older veterans (especially if Kirilenko and Watson are re-signed). Next year’s draft is very strong for small forwards, so if the Jazz actually get a lottery pick (or two), they would do well to pick up at least one promising young player at the SF position. If the Jazz play their cards right, they could be back in the hunt to make the playoffs and be a contender after only two rebuilding years (counting last year as a rebuilding year).

by Fesenko for President on Oct 24, 2011 3:53 PM MDT reply actions

Jefferson Goes

then Sap, then Hayward, then Favors.

Those aren’t the correct picks, but they are the emotional ones. This whole thing has been a mess since the #1 overall “draft pick” Raja left.

I guess Hayward could end up as #1. I would laugh really hard if that were the case.

I’ve been voting Millsap since day 2!

by davidthecomposer on Oct 24, 2011 9:28 PM MDT reply actions

I think that depends on how you define the correct pick

Utah>*

by Bebop on Oct 24, 2011 9:39 PM MDT up reply actions

Let's acknowledge the difference between facts and opinions

I’ve been voting for Al since day 2. But that’s just an opinion.

I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time

by Yucca Man on Oct 24, 2011 9:57 PM MDT up reply actions

all this voting based on "potential"

lol, thats funny, cut all the guys that you know can play, in favor of two rookies that showed flashes in 2 or 3 games late in the season, i dont know guys.

then again this is the same blog that worships fesenko

by handlogten on Oct 25, 2011 9:49 AM MDT reply actions

Would you give up a dollar now or the promise of 10 dollars later?

by Jeffersap on Oct 25, 2011 9:55 AM MDT up reply actions

Its not a 'Promise' of $10 later, there is just a potential for it.

Not all high draft picks with lots of potential turn into great players!

Will ALL of our high draft picks turn into great players? – I don’t think so. The odds would suggest that some of them turn into roll players, bench warmers, or flops.

I like out picks and I hope to see them play a lot, but being a ‘potential’ star and a real star are two completely different things.

by Big_B on Oct 25, 2011 11:33 AM MDT up reply actions