Jerry Sloan Cares Not For Your Fancy Three-point Shooting Team - The Downbeat - #478
I mentioned this before, but expect Sloan's name to come up a lot as coaching vacancies spring up around the league. This is the first case that I've heard his name associated with an opening. Marcus Thompson, a beat writer from the Bay Area News Group tweeted this (via j.e. skeets)
This of course comes because the Warriors decided they're not bringing back Keith Smart. Thompson later stated that Sloan is a "pipedream." He's not the only name on their list, but he will be on a lot of lists.
He hasn't come out yet and said that he's looking to coach again, nor will he, but he wouldn't be retired for long if that was his intent. The situation would have to be ideal for him to take over and I don't think the team that Golden State has now is that team. The biggest reason is that they're built to be a three-point shooting team with Dorell Wright, Monta Ellis, Stephen Curry, and Reggie Williams. They shoot a lot. They do have some makers though so Sloan would like that. But a Sloan system would cut into those 3PAs. They do have a good PF in David Lee and a decent defender in Andris Biedrins and recently-drafted Ekpe Udoh.
They're still very young overall and it would take a few years and a few changes to get them contending. Sloan could probably do it but I don't know if he wants a (re?)building project. I could only see him going to a team with established vets and a good recent track record.
Overall, I still think he stays retired. It would have to be a Godfather-type offer to pry him out of retirement. And again, a team would likely have to convince Phil Johnson to come back as well.
One more thing to consider would be how would the team take to a dramatic change to the offense they're running now? They would likely continue to score at a good rate. I would be most worried about Ellis and Sloan confrontations after numerous ill-advised shots. Ellis would be dog house candidate #1.
This article from the New York Post about Deron Williams provokes a couple of thoughts though neither are about Deron. There's nothing new there other than Billy King expects Deron to re-up with the Nets and DWill was touring the new arena.
In there though King talks about there goals for next season (making the playoffs) and how having a healthy Deron back and how players need to arrive in shape for training camp. Being in shape is something we heard from Sloan and the Jazz staff all the time. He did drop this nugget on Devin Harris though,
"We had a lot of guys that came in out of shape," King said. "Devin [Harris] didn't come in his best shape, Travis [Outlaw] didn't, Johan Petro; and a lot of these guys admitted it in our individual meetings. That's the start.
So one, is this something that we should be concerned about with Harris? And two, if there is a lockout and the start of the season is postponed into January or so, how will that affect other players' conditioning? Even if the players get together in September and resume their own training, you don't get the same kind of conditioning as you would for training camp.
The interesting thing about this photo of CJ (from his twitter account) is that in this picture, he's closer to being drafted (four years) than he is removed from being drafted (five years).
Salt City Hoops has a good podcast with Kurt Kragthorpe from the Trib.
Thursday open poll... Millsap or Jefferson? Go.
Kidding. Let's go with this one... If you're having to start a new team around just one player from the Jazz, who would it be?
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Gotta be Favors
With Hayward coming in a close second. It’s been said many time already, but I will say it again. Athletic bigs just dont come around all that often.
5.
Fessenko…If he was fused with Favors athleticism, and Jeffersons post moves. Kidding aside it would have to Favors ALL DAY.. ERRY DAY
"I hate it! It looks like a stickup at 7-Eleven. Five guys standing there with their hands in the air."
Norm Sloan
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors."
Weldon Drew
1. Sloan in Golden State would be like a Dirty Harry homecoming. It could be good for Jerry, if he wanted to return to the grind (and losing that he’ll get with that team); it would be great for the Golden State Warriors franchise . . . it would be horrible for that group of players though. They (exception of Curry) appear lazy and distracted. Talent exists, but not the brain.
2. I think part of it was that Harris knew he was coming into Nets training camp. The Jazz (esp with lockout doom) look to work with each other during the summer. While it’s not going to be a Sloan camp, it’ll still be rough. Some of the guys who have played here before will probably tell him. Also Harris has to work hard to prove that he wasn’t just a throw in to the trade for Favors and the DP.
3. That kid has really big hands
4. I will listen to it on my phone if I can, during the play the wife and i are going to tonight.
5. It would be Karl Malone as a head coach. Players would want to play for the Mailman. Also his players will not be allowed to miss games for silly things, and they will be in good shape year round, or not even be on the roster. He would also get a lot of ejections.
Check out: SLCDUNK.com ... E-Mail me at: allthatjazzbasketball@hotmail.com
Really, I'm totally not lonely or anything . . .
by AllThatJazzBasketball on Apr 28, 2011 10:32 AM MDT reply actions
One player to build around for the Jazz?
Derrick Favors. No question.
by Mark Jay Wahlen on Apr 28, 2011 10:46 AM MDT reply actions
Let me be the latest
to mention Favors as the building block. After all, we did trade our franchise guy for him… he better pan out.
(and his potential is through the roof)
Fingers Crossed MAYNE
"I hate it! It looks like a stickup at 7-Eleven. Five guys standing there with their hands in the air."
Norm Sloan
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors."
Weldon Drew
My Two Cents...
For what it’s worth, to me, if the Jazz are lucky enough to get one of the top two picks, and they land Irving or Williams, they need to trade current assets accordingly, and go all-out young. Some might not agree, but I would hate to see Favors/Hayward/ and Irving/Williams ride the pine when they could be gaining experience. Those guys are our future, so give them experience now.
I'm captain of the blow-it-up and go young crusade.
I absolutely agree. “Development” and “Experience” will NOT come by watching other guys take 80% of the shots, handle the ball for 80% of the possessions, and playing 20 or fewer minutes.
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
if sloan wants to come back
shud be the jazz kneeling and beg for forgiveness. otherwise i hope he ends up in Minnesota, been dying to know what that team capable of with a HoF coach. oh it wouldnt be so hard to get phil, as long as u get jerry, jerry will ask phil, phil will say “yes” in a heartbeat.
i dun know about every1 else, but someday, when all current rosters are grizzled and wrinkled and retired, i want some of em to spill the beans on what really happened…
a side note, jerry plays the people who earned the playtime, NOT ppl who deserve playtime. this is why swarm worked. this is why elson and fesenko, the 2 lowliest ranked players amongst jazz fandom, would still duke it out to give it their all everytime they’re on the floor… with the new and fancy kids getting deserved playtime, this will undoubtedly send a bad message to all the other 3rd-stringers… they dun have to be good enough to earn playing time, they only have to be good enough to earn a contract…
the jazz is usually regularly on playoffs, flirting with 2-4 seed… with new coach and new system of determining playing time and all, i certainly hope that we can get back to expecting a definite playoff spot next season, it would be totally heartbreaking and no “morale victory” can satisfy me if jazz still fail to make playoffs in next playing season.
really really side note, i just started playing NBA legends game on facebook, rlly cute, made a PG for my char, too bad no recruitable Malone so far, or Eaton :-( but it’s nice to see Jerry mug as the coach although the name has been changed to Corbin
I'll never say never
But the odds of this roster making the playoffs next year are about as close to 0% as you can get.
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
Its not as bad the second half of this season made it look!
Huge roster changes, huge coaching changes… and then we got lots of injuries to mess up our lineups. Then we have to go play a bunch of teams that might have had some of the injuries, but they had been playing all year together. ( other than Denver anyway )
IF we had started the year with this same lineup and with Corbin and the right number of assistants, we would have been winning at a much better rate than what we saw in the second half of the season.
I am not that optimistic either, but the odds of us making the playoffs are NOT zero. I would say the odds of us making the playoffs in two years are actually pretty good considering the young talent and tradeable assets we have.
How many teams in the past 30 years have jumped from 20-something wins to 45+ wins in one season?
Twelve.
OKC 2009-10.
Boston 2007-08.
Chicago 2004-05.
Phoenix 2004-05.
Washington 2004-05.
Memphis 2003-04.
New Jersey 2001-02.
Detroit 1995-96.
San Antonio 1997-98.
San Antonio 1989-90.
Houston 1984-85.
Boston 1979-80.
This is significant, because that’s the kind of jump the Jazz will need to make next year to make the 8th seed in the Western Conference.
Most of these jumps coincided with significant roster changes. Boston getting Larry Bird and later trading for Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen. San Antonio getting rookie David Robinson and, later, rookie Tim Duncan. Houston drafting Hakeem. Phoenix adding Steve Nash. New Jersey adding Jason Kidd. Washington adding Antawn Jamison. Memphis had a big roster turnover, plus 22-year old Pau. Chicago made major roster changes, clearing space for their new rookies (Deng and Ben Gordon).
Only OKC and Detroit managed this without major roster changes. OKC had 22-year old Durrant, and 2nd year Westbrook making a huge leap. Detroit had a similar situation with Grant Hill and Alan Houston in their second years.
For a team as bad as the Jazz were post Trade to make the playoffs the next year, without any major roster changes and without uber-young 2nd/3rd year players both playing leading roles and making huge leaps …
It has never happened before. Ever.
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
by Yucca Man on Apr 28, 2011 3:40 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
Most of those games were won when D Will was on the team
On top of that, we overachieved during the first part of the season. Our point differential was lower than what our record, up to that point, would have indicated.
To clarify,
our point differential was worse than what the point differential should have been for a team winning that many games. In other words, the first part of the season was a result of luck and getting by on the skin of our nose.
the team, post trade, was on pace for 24 wins
Their point differential, post-trade, was 5th worst in the league. In the Western Conference, only the T-Wolves were a worse team post-trade.
We’re not looking at a 6-win jump at all. We have to treat the baseline as a 24-win team. Yes there were injuries (though not as serious as some imply), yes there was a coaching change …
But the baseline from with the Jazz have to improve is that 24-win team. That’s what the team built around Al, Millsap, AK, Harris, and CJ was achieving. To jump up to 48-50 wins to make the playoffs—well that is a huge expectation. Considering the past 30 years of NBA history, I think it is completely unrealistic without a significant roster change.
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
The problem I have with our roster
Is that we’ll be good enough that we’ll get a poor pick-10-14 range. Yet, we won’t be good enough to make any noise. It’s a miserable existence. At least if your team is bad bad you can count on a top 5 pick, and with it the greater possibility of landing a solid player.
The Jazz need to decide if they are fisherman or bait cutters. No in between. Otherwise we’re stuck in the limbo of mediocrity for who knows how long
That's what really bugs me too
If they keep the current roster together, have a very injury-free year, if having a full training camp with Coach Ty has its best effect, if the chemistry is as good as it can be …
All evidence I’ve looked at suggests if those things happen their wins will end up in the mid-to-high 30’s. And considering that Al, MIllsap, and CJ aren’t going to be getting worse over the next 4-5 years, that’s what they’ll end up for the next 4-5 years.
Boo-yah!
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
I think you will get at least some roster changes.
We’ll have new rookies coming in, Ak may not come back, Millsap could easily get traded, and I think Harris could end up being moved eventually too. ( I expect they’ll give him awhile to see how he turns out)
It may not be the ‘team blow up’ you are looking for, but I am sure we’ll look much different by this time next year, and we’ll get a 2012 pick too.
I don’t think its likely that we’ll make the playoffs next year either, but I don’t think its as bad as you do. They may have been playing like a 24 win team, but as I stated before, I think the trades, coaches, and injuries were all a part of that. Starting the year off right with the same group… I’d would bet they’d end up around 30-35 games, and with Haward and Favors developing next year, I suspect they will be somewhere around .500.
IF our rookies arent turning out, the grim future you and Jeffersap are looking at could easily come true though.
You're more confident than me
When KOC says they have not interest in trading Millsap, when he comments that there can be no excuses for next year, referring specifically to himself, Ty, Al, and Harris—these combined with the team’s conservative history …
They don’t leave me confident that they are going to make changes. And, sadly, the longer big changes are delayed the longer the team has little hope of improvement. I’ve got a big post written about this. I’m just delaying posting it until after Amar finishes his awesome daily memories of the past season.
I do think Hayward will be getting really good, and that will have a big effect. But the idea of Favors playing 19 minutes because we still have Al and MIllsap—it kills me.
I got the crap beat out of me in Provo one time
At least we aggree on a few things....
I do think they have a pretty conservative past, but trading away D-will took guts. I don’t think they would plan to do a complete team rebuild with just one trade, so I am expecting there will be at least some small tweaks in our future. Drafting the best talent available may force their hand on that too.
He had to stay positive on the Millsap front for now. I agree though that 19 minutes a night aint cutting it for Favors. If Millsap can’t handle coming off the bench at 4, and/or produce some at the 3, I don’t think he’s going to work out. He is good trade bait, and Memo’s contract will be expiring, so I think something will happen.
When one looks at Derrick Favor's potential, it astounds me that both the Nets and Jazz didn't hand him 30 mpg right off the bat
Guys like Horford, Mourning, Howard—the players I want Favors to pattern himself after— all were. I don’t understand this. It’s like buying a new, expensive (you bet Favors was expensive—cost us a top ten player in his prime!) pair of shoes, than wearing your old ones because you don’t want to risk the small blister you might get by wearing a pair of unbroken in shoes.
Favors needs to play at least 30 mpg. Period. Anything less is unfathomable, a waste of his talent, and unfair to him.
I see chance of Jerry coming back at 1 in a million.
He said he didn’t have the energy to handle the stress. He’s got to be smart enough to know that its just going to come with the job – anywhere. Plus, he has been working in the same place forever, so everybody already loved him, and there was zero chance of possibly being fired. The media was pretty easy on him too.
Move to California ? No
Coach a bunch of young kids he didn’t help pick? (zero ‘old school’ players ?) – No
Work in a big city where every move you make is going to be scrutinized ? – No
5
John Stockton
Baseball is the only place in life where a sacrifice is really appreciated.
"Shoot baskets, not people." -AK

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